A chance to talk to FlatpanelsHD's reviewers.
By Evolution101
#1431
Thanks for a well put effort this weekend.

My question is, how does it compare overall to the V10? You mentioned the THX mode that was slightly better than the V10 but V10 was not just that, it was better in total due to lots of things from what I understand (regarding picture quality, gaming etc). So how does this stand to V10 all in all?

Sincerely
By migube_
#1439
Hi guys,

many thanks for this quite interesting test!
How does the anti-reflection compares with the Philips IPS panels from the old 7404 or 8404 range eg ?

I'm hesitating between both, and matte, or anti reflection is quite important to me.

Also another question: what is the delay introduced by the IFC frame calculation?
I tested this on the Philips DNM and it introduces a delay that makes the sound coming from the DVD Optical outs, much before the actual HDMI image is displayed ...
I was hoping to use the Optical out on the TV, but it does not handle DTS on the Philips, only AC3.
I guess the Panasonic Optical out will have the same limitations, only AC3, no DTS pass through from HDMI ? (although in the datasheet it says: Dolby Digital Plus/dts Out/CoNEQ (not sure what coneq is?)
ARC on HDMI 1.4 might be a solution for later on newer Surround amplifiers?


tx
Last edited by migube_ on 02 Mar 2010, 12:27, edited 2 times in total.
By agregus
#1440
Hi guys,

awesome test! Love the new G20!! I will buy the 50" for EU (i think its the same for US). I have one question - that calibration from test will be best also for 50" G20? Or you can recommend me another one?

THANK YOU.

That Pioneers guys - Panasonic bought complete technology from Pioneer on 2009. They are using it on models in this year -
Code: Select all
http://www.flatpanelshd.com/article.php?subaction=showfull&id=1266224400
"In the summer of 2009 Panasonic acquired the Pioneers KURO technology and patents. Panasonic does not say it directly but they indicate that the KURO technology is part of the 2010 VIERA line-up. A so-called Infinite Black Pro panel increases native (!) contrast to 5.000.000:1."
By youbecha
#1444
The previous models were known for not doing well with 24p material. Maybe I missed it, you mentioned that the ISF(?) should be turned off for this mode, but you didn't say how the tv did when ISF was off and 24p was being delivered by the blu-ray...ie flicker and artifacts.

I was going to get a V model because of 24p performance, but maybe I can get a G instead.
User avatar
By Rasmus Larsen
#1449
Evolution101 wrote:Thanks for a well put effort this weekend.

My question is, how does it compare overall to the V10? You mentioned the THX mode that was slightly better than the V10 but V10 was not just that, it was better in total due to lots of things from what I understand (regarding picture quality, gaming etc). So how does this stand to V10 all in all?

Sincerely
The G20 is not a major improvement compared to the V10. The THX profile is a bit better (also because the V10 had a faulty THX magenta implementation, nothing really serious but it affected some colors). But G20 deals better with reflections - both in-panel and on the surface (the glass front on V10 was bad).
Shadow detail is also a bit better than on V10.

Also, the G20 has some added functionality.

What I'm trying to say is that G20 is not a major improvement but I would still pick G20 over V10 - especially because of the reflection thing.
Personally I like the design of V10 a lot better, though.
User avatar
By Rasmus Larsen
#1450
Crunchie wrote:How does the G20 compare with my PX60 which I am planning to replace?
If you like your PX60 you will love the G20. It's the same picture philosophy but a lof of improvements have been made.
User avatar
By Rasmus Larsen
#1451
migube_ wrote:Hi guys,

many thanks for this quite interesting test!
How does the anti-reflection compares with the Philips IPS panels from the old 7404 or 8404 range eg ?
The 9704H deals with reflections quite well but it's a bit different. The G20 has a glossy panel. 9704H has a matte panel. If you're very concerned about reflections I believe that the matte panel will serve you better. But in terms of picture quality I like G20 better. And because of the new panel that reduces reflections I think that it's actually fine for daytime viewing (the old G10 had some issues).
Also another question: what is the delay introduced by the IFC frame calculation?
I tested this on the Philips DNM and it introduces a delay that makes the sound coming from the DVD Optical outs, much before the actual HDMI image is displayed ...
I was hoping to use the Optical out on the TV, but it does not handle DTS on the Philips, only AC3.
I guess the Panasonic Optical out will have the same limitations, only AC3, no DTS pass through from HDMI ? (although in the datasheet it says: Dolby Digital Plus/dts Out/CoNEQ (not sure what coneq is?)
ARC on HDMI 1.4 might be a solution for later on newer Surround amplifiers?
The input lag introduced by the Philips DNM and Hz circuits is quite bad in my opinion.

Panasonic's IFC has much less input lag in games and most of the time you wont even feel it in practical use. I don't see any issues with IFC and gaming.

I'm not sure about the audio thing. I didn't play too much with the audio outputs.
User avatar
By Rasmus Larsen
#1452
agregus wrote:Hi guys,

awesome test! Love the new G20!! I will buy the 50" for EU (i think its the same for US). I have one question - that calibration from test will be best also for 50" G20? Or you can recommend me another one?
Sure, you should be able to copy settings on the 50" without trouble. Panasonic has very similar panels in their different inch classes.
It's a different story with LCD manufacturers that often use different LCD panel technologies depending on the size of the TV. For example the Sony W5500.
User avatar
By Rasmus Larsen
#1453
Crunchie wrote:Thanks for the review, but does the ISFccc allow adjustment of the tint/hue controls for PAL as well as the RGB cuts/boosts?
Yep, the G20 has RGB gain, RGB cut, RGB hue and RGB saturation.

It also has different gamma steps.

You need to activate the ISFccc in the "setup" sub-menu, though.
User avatar
By Rasmus Larsen
#1454
youbecha wrote:The previous models were known for not doing well with 24p material. Maybe I missed it, you mentioned that the ISF(?) should be turned off for this mode, but you didn't say how the tv did when ISF was off and 24p was being delivered by the blu-ray...ie flicker and artifacts.

I was going to get a V model because of 24p performance, but maybe I can get a G instead.
The G10 had two kind of problems. In the states it had flickering (which was not a problem in the EU because of a higher frequency output) and juddering in the EU because the 24 Hz implementation was faulty (this was not a problem in the states, but corrected later on in EU because we forced Panasonic to do so through our Danish site FlatpanelsDK).

G20 has proper 1080p24 support without juddering (except from the minor judder that is intended with 24 Hz) and without flickering if you turn of the IFC.
If you turn on IFC frame, interpolation will be added to the 1080p24 signals. This means that you will not experience the "cinematic"-feeling that most people enjoy in the cinemas and with 1080p24 but a smoother and softer picture like with the 100/200 Hz LCD-TVs.
User avatar
By Rasmus Larsen
#1455
alibiy wrote:hi,
is the difference betwenn g20 and v20 worth to be paid??
It's hard to say. I have seen the V20 a few times now and expererienced very deep blacks. But I need to wait until V20 has arrived here to conclude anything.

And yeah, we plan to review both V20 and VT20 :)